Your God(ess) won the Face Off.

Si! Nos Podemos! vs Your God(ess)

Peace
Face Offs: 21
Wins: 9
Losses: 10
Ties: 2
Fort Worth, TX
All Face Offs
2
Votes
Fdr
Face Offs: 10
Wins: 9
Losses: 1
Ties: 0
No City, XX
All Face Offs
3
Votes

What are your hopes and/or fears for the coming administration? This is a repost because I'm looking for constructive ideas, not bitter partisan rants


This is intended to be very open-ended. I hope there can be lots of comments, because I am interested in all kinds of input. This is-for the most part- an intelligent forum for us to bounce socio-political ideas off one another, and debate over our countlessly differing beliefs. I've grown very tired of all this partisan squabbling, and I'd hoped it would have dissipated after the election. It clearly has not, so let us hear what you have to say about the future. What are your hopes and/or fears? What are your ideas, theories, or priorities? Go any direction you see fit, and maybe we can find some common ground or acknowledge the vitality of our differences. I'm mostly concerned about the Obama administration, but we can consider things even further down the line if that's what concerns you most. The economy, environment, Darfur, Gaza Strip, Russia, lobbyists, partisanship, energy, Social Security, gay marriage, Venezuela, China, North Korea, Somalia (pirates, honestly?) Education, Health Care, Investment and Consumer Regulation, campaign financing, pseudo-fascism which Obama is accused of, GOP regressivity, Democratic totalitarianism, the list is infinite. Let's tackle some issues


I'm worried people will still try to say the market is the best answer for everything. I mean, in theory, it sounds nice and would work, but that is the problem! Perfectly competitive markets are theoretical!

Another concern is that people will try to over do things. This can be for anything from regulation and deregulation to throwing troops around in Iraq and Afghanistan. I do hope we get out of Iraq, but I'm reluctant to leave Afghanistan and Pakistan when things are not looking good (and since Pakistan has nukes).

One other concern involves Henry Paulson. I recently heard that he used the bailout money in a different way than he was supposed to without telling anyone. I really think he needs the boot.

Hopes: great health care reform, higher and a fairer and more equal tax system, better energy efficiency, and an economy rebuilt on an expansion of the high-tech industry of America (which I think is the best way to go into the future).

That is sorta it... OH! One last thing: equality for homosexuals in California and elsewhere. GO CALIFORNIA! PROMOTE EQUALITY! SET THE BEST EXAMPLE FOR THE COUNTRY! WHOOOO!!! (in case it isn't obvious, I live in California).


Didn't Cali pass prop 8? Total crap, it is very disappointing that this inequality still hasnt' been rectified. I hope that Congress can address the problem. I also hope that we can see an alteration in the passing of legislation by cutting out lobbyism, earmarks, and porkbarrel spending that is still somehow being overlooked. I hope that Obama's cabinet is fair and bipartisan in their actions, though his picks all have a stark liberal history. I hope that Daschle puts together a new health care plan that works enough to lower costs and cover those who need it most, instead of the bidding wars between insurance companies we now have, which leaves many of us in massive debt. I hope that Clinton, if elected, goes for immediate diplomatic action with Sudan and China over Darfur, Russia over former soviet states' sovereignty, and Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iran for encouraging theocratic militancy and allowing public drug trafficking. Most of all, I hope we focus on GREEN tech, and push for green education from school level on up. We need to shape a green economy in all aspects and work to create millions of new jobs based on skyrocketing demand for efficient, clean energy.


I know, cali did pass prop eight, I'm just rooting on the people trying to undo that, like the attorney general and the courts and all them.

One other hope for me is that Obama doesn't bring in too many Clintonites... ESPECIALLY NOT HILLARY HERSELF! EWW! I think she would do better in the senate.

Some more concerns include Obama being forced to use force against N. Korea or Iran, staying in Iraq too long, and maybe Russia feeling powerful and doing some nasty things... eww..... But that is mostly foreign things not going well, not Obama doing something bad... w/e

I think that is kinda it... for now... yeah....


Ah, okay. I agee, hopefully the courts will do the right thing here. One great thing about using the courts is that those massive California Churches can't simply buy theirselves a victory, like they managed to do on the ballot. I find it sad that they put so much effort into that particular vote, whose outcome has absolutely no effect on THEM whatsoever. I fear that after Obama there could be a huge right wing backlash, like there was with Carter and Clinton. I also fear that there is a current liberal backlash, though most hearts seem to be in the right place. We can't be too far left or right, or we'll always end up with policies that please only a certain faction, which will get reversed or altered once someone from the opposition gets elected.I fear that we are too late with regards to environmental adherence. I fear that we've dug ourselves into an economic hole that will cause the entire market to collapse in on itself, or we will over regulate and the markets will limp for years on bad liquidation and credit schemes. I fear that Obama will be pegged as another Clinton too soon. I fear that he will end up that way. I fear the severing of ties w/ Russia, China, or Pakistan.


One other hope I have is that some of the types of talking going on (a-HEM!!!!!!!!) comes to a close. People who insult the messenger without thinking about what the messenger is saying (that kind of comes from a quote I agree with that appears at the top of the site... useful, that) are a type that comes to mind.

Another hope I have is that today's youth becomes much more involved in the political process rather than playing computer games all the time (or whatever the hell most of them do nowadays... maybe a bunch of them do some nice stuff, but I want ALL of them to get out there and be social- or political-activists.

Fears I have include people lying to others on how to vote or how not to vote. Nothing disgusts me more than lying or blind ignorance (and then whining when things don't go right after lying or something is even worse!). My fears also include people acting without thought... as they have been for a while (aka Bush... and his Bushisms...)

I guess that is sort of it...

Comments

Add Your Comment
Peace

High and unbalanced tax code is immoral. The only fair tax is for everyone to pay exactly the same amount. Failing that, at least the same percentage.

Report Offensive Comment
Clinton

I hope that this administration will close gitmo and begin to restore our reputation in the world. I also hope that somehow we manage to find a way for all to have healthcare (I believe it is a human right) and a decent education. I hope that the tax code is adjusted so that people who have the means to pay a bit more will do so and those on the brink of poverty will not be expected to pay as much. And I hope that wise decisions will be made for new supreme court justices who understand not only the constitution, but the human condition as well.

Report Offensive Comment
Fdr

Interesting, weeklycigar... However, I'd put that in the category of "overdoing things." Why? Because it is much more immoral and wrong to tax someone making less than the national median income to pay the same amount as a rich person making about 500 times the median income. Think about it.... should the poor pay the same as the rich? Now THAT is immoral. Same with same percentage. What imbecile would tax someone making 500 times the income someone else makes the same percentage? 10% of 40,000 is much more to that person than 10% of someoe's income which is 20,000,000. In the end, it would be 36,000 to 18,000,000! That is a disgusting difference!!!

Report Offensive Comment
Flagbutton

I'll just say that God (ess) is right on this one.

Report Offensive Comment
Peace

Tax Code has nothing to do with morality. It's about what is practical. Is it practical for everyone to pay the same ACTUAL amount? Absolutely not. And for percentage, well we've tried that several times, most specifically w/ Regan and Bush, and both times they have been great for the top ten percentage of American income earners, not to mention the tax breaks large corporations and (obviously) the absurd leniency for investment companies and banks to lend out 30 times what they actually posses in liquid capital, while also incurring several convenient tax breaks. Hear me now: The theory of Reaganomics only works in the same sense as a dog begging for scraps at the table. Any good animal person will throw them a bone or a small chunk of meat, but that's about all that 'trickles down' to those below the table/middle class line. All Reagan and Bush accomplished with taxes was a huge increase in 1. Our nation's luxury and consumer spending 2. Encouraged recklessness with the handling of mortgage and investment companies, and 3. Wealth for those who were already well beyond the mark of wealthy. Anyone who believes that we need to tax everyone equally has either never done their own expense and tax reports, or they had money their whole life. If we want to talk about fair (because morality isn't really the thing here), we need to consider what's best for all of the people of our nation, not wonder 'what is the simplest formula for taxation possible?' or 'will this satisfy those who never have to truly worry about money, or those in power?' Fair is equality, but with finance, equality is not measured in black and white dollar amounts, it is about what is relevant to your means to survive and live comfortably, and the difference in our country between the upper class and everyone else is remarkably huge. I mean there is just no comparison in terms of means or comfort. The word comfort itself is completely different btwn the classes. For lower classes, comfort is getting by enough to make it to the next paycheck. Middle Class comfort is having a decent home and a savings accout earning SOME interest. Upper class comfort, well, let's just say its something along the lines of being able to have a cpa balance your cd's and ira's right and find those countless little tax breaks out there for the wealthy consumer, and having enough money after that year's bonus to go to Europe or somewhere else you feel like going to. Oh, and not being caught for insider trading, because everyone in the stock trade does it to some extent, but only celebrities ever get called out for it.

Report Offensive Comment
Reagan

Of course taking from one person to give to someone else, by force, is wrong and immoral. I donate approximately 10 - 15% of my income to various charity institutions. Obama Bin Biden? much less. If my taxes go up, I will stop donating period. No more charity.

Report Offensive Comment
Independent

The system is broken folks, the flaws of Capitalism within the gates of a Greed driven Democracy is on the verge of total collapse. The Great Roman Empire comes to mind... Where there is will, there is a way. I believe in hope because thats all we got right now. I scorn those who are responsible.

Report Offensive Comment
Capitol

Wow, isn't so nice to watch you all pat yourselves on the back and have a "civilized" debate. You know, the whole point is to argue your views with others that have a different position than you do. Thus, the whole point of "debating." So, to begin your premise looking for "constructive ideas" and not "partisan rants" is ridiculous. I'm LMAO. Give me a break. Why don't you just begin your own site, where you can all get together and back yourselves on the back for your "wonderful" and "innovative" ideas? If you've grown tired of the "partisan squabbling," go somewhere else where everyone one agrees with you. HELLLLOOOO! Its called elephant-donkey.com. The whole point being republicans and democrats debating each other on their different partisan beliefs.

Report Offensive Comment
Fdr

Okay, Iowan, I'll keep that in mind................ sorry I'm not living up to your expectations...

Report Offensive Comment
Clinton

Hmmm, well Iowan, in this post we were having quite a civilized debate. On some others, not so much. Or do you condone some on this site saying that people should go out whoring instead of going on welfare to feed their families. Do you condone people talking about shooting others for their political beliefs? Thats what some of your buddies on the site have sunk to. So before you get all high and mighty, do some reading. If you believe what they are saying is actual debate, then you have no idea what a debate is.

Report Offensive Comment
Fdr

If this is true of FrankMonkey: "Of course taking from one person to give to someone else, by force, is wrong and immoral. I donate approximately 10 - 15% of my income to various charity institutions. Obama Bin Biden? much less. If my taxes go up, I will stop donating period. No more charity," then we should tax him about 20% more! That way we will come out ahead. lol....

Report Offensive Comment
Capitol

Well, P2B, no, I haven't seen that on here, but then again I've been too busy to be on here lately. And no, if they have stooped to that level then I don't agree with them. But Hunt generally does a pretty good job of using fact and logic to back up his arguments and every one of you circles round to castrate him - despite his penchant for name calling - which BTW I find highly amusing. And the few times I've argued, I've been called some pretty ruthless things. Guess what goes around comes around. Conservatives can only take so much of the crap that's been slung on here and nationwide by liberals attacking our very core beliefs - guess they're finally firing back - albeit in a pretty offensive way - but hey, everything about conservatives offends you, so you should be used to it by now. BTW - exactly what debates were those things said and I'll look at them.

Report Offensive Comment
Clinton

The one about welfare is a good start. It started with a very good civil debate between two people who disagree about social welfare and disintegrated in the comments section. Its also the whole nate rant about hitler while I argued in another post. I would like to see your ability to laugh about a man who has exterminated most of your family. And BTW, there have been many conservatives who have been on this site and not orally castrated. I am not going to go into hunt with you as he is a foul creature and its not name calling that bothers me. Call me what you will, it is no a big thing and can be brushed off. Its racist rants and hate posts that get my back up. For the past 8 years conservatives in power have attacked my core beliefs relentlessly. Now they have dropped from power in a very substantial way and I am very happy about it. If I am crowing my happiness, so be it. Now you can feel what I have been feeling for almost a decade.

Report Offensive Comment
Peace

Your core beliefs are incorrect. If you thought instead of felt, you might get somewhere.

Report Offensive Comment
Peace

And I think Nate was calling Obama a nazi because the liberal nuts have been calling bush hitler for years.

Report Offensive Comment
Peace

You are too easily offended, toots.

Report Offensive Comment
Clinton

My core beliefs are just fine weekly. I think far more than most of your buddies who are off amusing themselves on other posts by calling people obscene names. And i have never used the name Hilter to describe anyone other than the monster who cause the death of 6 million Jews. Its just disgusting and wrong, whoever does it. I have called Rev out a few times when he goes overboard. This is not ideology I am pissed off by, it is racist crap and hate posts without basis. I do not get offended by much weekly, except of course stupidity that has recently been exhibited by a bunch of your pals.

Report Offensive Comment
Clinton

Oh and Iowan, could you direct me to the posts where you have been called a b**ch, a wh*re or a sl*t? Thats what your pals are calling people. Can you truly as a Christian accept that? Is that what your God finds acceptable? I am so confused by people on this site (and I am not speaking about you) who profess being moral and righteous and then throw this stuff out here. There are things in the world that are just wrong. Racism is wrong. Slander is wrong. Hatred is wrong. Its what my religion has taught me and it is an intrinsic part of the way I live my life. I may disagree with your views on many things, but I will fight for your right to have those views. I will not advocate your death because of them (as weekly and fitz have done in the past couple of days).

Report Offensive Comment
Peace

DisgustedIowan, I'm not sure why the concept of progressive thinking and civilized debating makes you laugh so. The specific reason I put that in the title, was because my inital face off was partisan slander. Obviously this is a forum where we are not to agree on issues that are essential and fundamental to our own beliefs, so if ANYTHING we are here to bounce ideas off one another like adults who are concerned with making ACTUAL headway on issues that are plaguing our nation. No one here is looking to get a pat on the back, but you CAN have a debate without resorting to namecalling and unbacked opinions like "liberals are ruining america" or "the gop are all nazis." There is no need for this type of argument, because we can all agree that our nation has been at its most effective when the two conflicting ideologies have balanced with one another, pandering to citizen's needs and demands for that particular time in history. Just because I disagree with many GOP ideas does not mean that I believe their hearts to not be in the right place, with exceptions that include Bush and Rumsfield. Partisan squabbling does not mean that you disagree based on your party's talking points, we encourage this greatly. What we DISCOURAGE is using someone's party as a scapegoat or a reason in itself for why you disagree with them. You can call someone a gun totin' bible beating right winger, but what gets accomplished with that? NOTHING. Same thing with blaming everything on those 'damned liberals.' It has no relevance with regards to actually getting somewhere with our ideas, which is the entire point of our democracy. We are supposed to engage actively in trying to come up with better ways to be governed to subsequently be left to our devices and the potential of human masses. If we all just sat around and called each other names, which you seem to find funny, there wouldn't be any progress made at all. Perhaps a comedy forum would be ideal for you, one for self-important a**holes that believe calling a politician a Nazi is a new thing, and a funny way to put someone from the opposite party down since some other random idiot decided that criticizing Bush by calling HIM Hitler was a valid way of calling him out for the terrible policies he and Congress pushed through.

Report Offensive Comment

Post A Comment

Please keep it clean. Bad words will get filtered, and offensive comments will be removed.


or cancel

CNN TOP POLITICAL STORIES

TOP STORIES on TIME.COM

TIME PHOTO ESSAYS

Photos: The Hajj Goes High-Tech

Advances in infrastructure and security improve the experience of Islam's holiest pilgrimage

( )


Athens in Flames

A massive student protest against proposed government reforms of state universities developed into major rioting in the streets of the Greek capital following the shooting of a teenage boy by riot police.

(Louisa Gouliamaki / AFP / Getty)